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View Full Version : 17/0/44 0/7/54

01-08-2007, 10:36 AM
So, I'm thinking of finishing off my leveling for my alliance mage next. My horde mage is currently 17/0/44 for silence, which can be real useful and clearcasting is nice too. But I'm thinking of respeccing to 0/7/44.

The reasoning behind it is getting more points in frost + using molten armor instead of ice armor. Giving -5% crit chance to all attacks on me + proccing impact is pretty much as frequent as frostbite but gives a stun instead of a slow. But the biggest reason is for more points in frost.

Just wondering on comments, it's pretty much for general pvp play + arena (eventually).

I know 17/0/44 is pretty much the most popular build at the moment. And uninterrupted frost-nova, silence, frost-bolt, ice-lance or silence-polymorph can be imba. But I've found lots of times it gets countered wasting my cs cooldown. Though when it works it's nice ;D

Wondered if anyone had any thoughts or discussion? :o

01-08-2007, 10:54 AM
Since 0/7/44 adds up to 51 talent points I asumme you mean 0/7/54?

01-08-2007, 10:57 AM
yus, he wrote 0/7/54 in threads name :P.

01-08-2007, 11:06 AM
Ja, 0/7/54 as topic says. Was a typo in the first paragraph sorry. Too many 44's flying around xD I'd fix it but I can't be bovved to edit my post.

03-08-2007, 10:37 PM
Hello I've found some debate about it.

As I look over the most popular specs for Mages in the top teams, I notice almost every mage is running 17/0/44. I believe this to be an inferior spec to 0/7/54 and I'm going to go over why.

The first thing you need to decide, is whether to run Molten Armor or Ice Armor. Personally, I use Molten Armor and here's why. The additional armor provided from Ice Armor works out to be about 4% additional damage reduction vs all physical attacks, which is most commonly warriors. Molten Armor gives 5% reduced chance to be crit, a comparable amount of overall damage reduction. However, it's vs all non-dot damage instead of physical only. Additionally, reducing enemy crit chance becomes better the more you have of it. Simply put, taking someone's chance to crit from 25% to 20% is good, taking it from 20% to 15% is better. So for example, me being nuked by a frost mage with an average 22% crit. I wear 400 resilience, and run molten armor and now 2 out of every 3 attacks that would have crit, is a non-crit instead.

The other factors you need to compare are the chance to proc Frostbite with Ice Armor vs proc Impact with Molten Armor. When you proc a Frostbite there's a decent chance already that your attacker has freedom. Let's just negate that for the moment though. Let's assume your frostbite lands, and lasts full duration. You're going to be hamstrung. By the time you walk slowly out of that warrior's melee range, at least 2-3 seconds will have passed of him still beating on you. Then the frostbite will break and he'll be right back on you. Molten Armor with impact on the other hand instantly stops him from attacking. When you combine that with the fact that Molten Armor is doing a small amount of damage back to your attacker, and that it gives you 3% offensive crit, it's a clear cut choice in favor of Molten Armor. Also, to dispel any rumours, Molten Armor crits do NOT proc enrage on warriors.

Now, to get Improved Counterspell, you need to "waste" 15 other points in Arcane in talents that could be used elsewhere. I mean really, look at the tree. Everything up to Improved Counterspell is completely useless, with the exception of Clearcasting, which you make up for and then some by having Frost Channeling. I'm going to dispel a very common myth here while I'm at it. Spell hit does not, and never did, have any effect on "Increases chance to resist Silence/Interrupt" mechanics. Those mechanics no longer exist, but the point remains.

Consider also that when you counterspell, it is very rarely pre-emptive, especially in 5v5. 98% of the time you want to use counterspell, it's to lock out a healer while he's casting. If he can't heal anyway, who cares if that Shaman can Frost Shock, or Druid can Starfire. They're useless. Instead of wasting all those points in the Arcane tree to get a talent with minimal use, why not spend them in Fire and Frost? Here's what you gain when you lose Improved Counterspell:

-Impact/Molten Armor synergy to replace the less useful Ice Armor
-Longer range fireblast(31 yards with glove bonus)
-3/3 Improved Cone of Cold for stronger instant bursts
-1 extra point in Winter's Chill for slightly better debuff spamming
-15% reduced mana cost on all Frost spells. I run out of mana in the arena ALL the time.

That's a whole lot to be gained by switching out those mostly wasted points in Arcane, don't you think?

Taken from http://www.pvpscene.com/