Log in

View Full Version : Lock specs I don't often see


Faylin
15-05-2007, 10:18 AM
For soloing...

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=AVMrVMfkmZfxzzIbzZxx0z
Sacrifice Succubus for imba shadow damage or sacrifice felpuppy for regen.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=IVMrVMfkVzZMxczIizMh
Dark Pact + 2 points in mana feed to make your pet an endless mana battery.
(would have to test out what the best distribution is between Master Demonologist and Mana Feed)

So, are these worse or better then 43/0/18 ish kinda builds for (mostly) soloing? I;m actually surprised not to see em more often. Or does the lack of burst damage make em less desireable in the end?

Mithadriel
15-05-2007, 11:20 AM
Interesting specs for soloing. Think I remember seeing them bandied about a lot more pre-launch of TBC.

Having not actually tried them I can't really comment properly on whether or not they are worse/better than 43/0/18 - the only things I can say is that most people who spec Affliction heavily do so for multiple mob kills (and loldps on long boss fights).

Its ridiculously easy with 43/0/18 to handle 4/5 (6?) mobs without any real danger of dying as a result of Imp HoT.

The two specs you've posted I guess would leave you susceptible to being mashed to pieces by multiple mobs as you have no real facility for putting space between you and the mobs (other than normal HoT which is a PITA if your up against melee'ing mobs). Which means your then focusing on single/double targets - then your missing the burst DPS as you say from a heavy Destro spec to deal with them effectively.

Swings and roundabouts ... if I ever stop raiding I might try those specs out tho for kicks :)

Corruption
15-05-2007, 05:04 PM
That manafeed / dark pact talent build is overkill, I myself dont go through mana like that, well sometimes I do if i spam Immolate (best damage per mana / dps spell) but with that spec immolate sucks.

Faylin
15-05-2007, 05:19 PM
Aight, makes sense. So, what if you'd put all 5 points in master demonologist and grind with the succubus out?

Corruption
15-05-2007, 06:08 PM
I dont use drain life or mana when grinding really, I used to when i had improved howl of terror (as in gather lots, dot all and tap/drain life) but that spec doesnt include contagion, imp howl of terror or unstable affliction :S

Teatrix
21-05-2007, 08:52 AM
The loss of Improved Howl of Terror is pretty huge. Even with fel concentration, if you have multiple mobs on you, drain life will be heavily interrupted. Imp Howl is simply too good for multimobs. UA is very much the same as corruption (damagewise) so it will probably do at least comparable, if not more damage, with it than with 15% more on your other spells.

And neither spec is really good for single target, I'd go 0/21/40 for that, even for grinding. That should have mobs dropping in 3-4 casts, maybe a searing pain/conflag as finisher. It is probably more gear dependant than other specs, though, so it might be a bad idea :p You have to drink/bandage, but no downtime isn't really good if you use a minute per mob. Go for xp/gold/rep per hour when mesuring effectiveness.

The best idea is probably to test them out. Three hours or so of grinding the same spot with each spec and you'd have a definitive answer! My gut feeling is that you'd get better results with the "classic" specs, but it might be worth a try...

And unless you use sac, you should always use a succubus (or felguard) when grinding for a little bit of melee damage (turn off all skills).

Faylin
21-05-2007, 09:57 AM
And unless you use sac, you should always use a succubus (or felguard) when grinding for a little bit of melee damage (turn off all skills).

I personally don't like succubus at all. I grind with felhunter. Does (some) melee damage aswell, while I drain it's mana. It also removes buffs and debuffs and silences annoying mobs.
Another advantage of a melee based pet imo is that is that it can offtank mobs for a few secs.

Thanks for the other tips though. I will get improved howl of terror yeh, it seems pretty win. So I'm afraid it's gonna be a boring old 43/0/18 ish kinda thing.

profile --> http://armory.wow-europe.com/#character-sheet.xml?r=Shadowsong&n=Calamit%C3%A9

Teatrix
21-05-2007, 12:38 PM
I personally don't like succubus at all. I grind with felhunter. Does (some) melee damage aswell, while I drain it's mana. It also removes buffs and debuffs and silences annoying mobs.
Another advantage of a melee based pet imo is that is that it can offtank mobs for a few secs.


A good point, felhunter can usually function with just 300-400 mana, unlike the succy... each seduce costs 700 mana for me :)

Think of the "old, boring" 43/0/18 spec as just the same as affliction/demo hybrid, only with another dot to play around with and an instant fear ;) Especially at low levels of +damage gear, UA should add more damage than a multiplier (wich is where you are, hmm.....)

Oh, and if you like, you can probably just put the 18 destruction points in affliction if you intend to do nothing but soloing, since you should spend most of your time casting dots and maybe using nightfall procs. (Though it might be worth it just for shadowburn.)

Faylin
21-05-2007, 12:42 PM
Yeh, I think I'll go get UA asap. I have more +damage then is good for me (lifetap ouch! :P), so another dot is probably win.

Haplo
21-05-2007, 12:51 PM
Call me old fashioned but i always grind with VW out... Easy to offtank when i pull a bit too much mobs. Good mana regen also for Dark Pact. Works pretty good for me. Dont get into any trouble.
im 41/9/11 build.

Psonica
21-05-2007, 02:35 PM
Call me old fashioned but i always grind with VW out... Easy to offtank when i pull a bit too much mobs. Good mana regen also for Dark Pact. Works pretty good for me. Dont get into any trouble.
im 41/9/11 build.

u R old, lol! :D

So is the VW able to hold aggro long enough for the DoT's to tick a few times these days? I remember it being really bad at that ...a long time ago that is.

Actually when I think of it VW is the least used of my pets - the felhunter is quickly gaining popularity even in instances these say (silence/counterspell/dispell is the win!).

Corruption
21-05-2007, 02:51 PM
VW is better nowadays aye, Consume Shadows giving him an extra 200 AP is also handy.

Mithadriel
21-05-2007, 11:21 PM
Actually when I think of it VW is the least used of my pets - the felhunter is quickly gaining popularity even in instances these say (silence/counterspell/dispell is the win!).

I started using it again a couple of weeks ago after a friend recommended it for grinding motes of mana in netherstorm down at the violet tower - I was like "er duh I forgot they had counterspell" - it's SO useful ... using it more than the VW nowadays.

Haplo
22-05-2007, 11:43 AM
u R old, lol! :D

So is the VW able to hold aggro long enough for the DoT's to tick a few times these days? I remember it being really bad at that ...a long time ago that is.

Actually when I think of it VW is the least used of my pets - the felhunter is quickly gaining popularity even in instances these say (silence/counterspell/dispell is the win!).

Grrmmbbll not that old.... :P

But yeah VW will hold aggro with some dots on the target. When the target goes for me, life drain or shadow bolt and wont even make it close enough to hit me.

Feldoggie in instance... hmm indeed a win situation in some cases.

Psonica
22-05-2007, 12:43 PM
Feldoggie in instance... hmm indeed a win situation in some cases.
Heroic Mech ...win!

Dreadling
27-05-2007, 06:52 PM
I seem to always end up back with the imp. Doesnt matter if im grinding, instancing, raiding, whatever. I tried using other pets but i always seem to prefer the imp.

There are, ofcourse, situations where other pets are more usefull, but in general i find imp does the trick.

A little bit off-topic, but is destruction a dying breed of lock? seems like there are fewer and fewer of us around...

Dread

Theleb
28-05-2007, 04:40 PM
There are still a few around (I've run that spec a couple of times) however I don't think we're ever going to see a resurgence of the popularity they enjoyed when people like Drakedog and Ashen were making videos.

Great spec for trash, and probably a great spec for Boss Fights if there is someway to counter the mana concerns but on the whole I don't think that mana preservation is the real issue - its simply that there are better specs out there for DPS/PvP and Destruction has always required a little finesse to play effectively....;p (even tho that might sound like a contradiction ^^ )

Pet = Felguard for soloing/Grinding and then Instance choice depends on role required - Imp for Bosses, Succy for trash most likely.

Teatrix
30-05-2007, 12:16 PM
Actually... the way blizzard insists on having loads of crit on stuff, coupled with the fact that you can run into the debuff limit if you stack too many affliction locks and shadowpriest, there might very well be more and more 0/21/40 locks in high end raids ;)

dantheman
30-05-2007, 01:59 PM
A little bit off-topic, but is destruction a dying breed of lock? seems like there are fewer and fewer of us around...

Dread


/wave

Theleb
30-05-2007, 02:07 PM
/wave

Always a few Old School who Fly the Flag ;p

(Stigmata too?)

Gruze
31-05-2007, 10:36 AM
Destro wins, End of discussion.

Theleb
31-05-2007, 10:49 AM
Talking to Glaxidus the other day (Die Hard Destro lock in Original) and his comment was purely "123123 Resists, going to spec affliction"....thats with decent gear too ^^

dantheman
31-05-2007, 11:45 AM
So get more +hit then...

Corruption
31-05-2007, 01:45 PM
I hardly ever resist also, hit gear isnt hard to get and its not as if the gear with +hit suck. I believe theres some +hit enchants also? if you're lacking hit grab them or epic gems such as the one from Quagmirran (heroic) http://www.thottbot.com/i30605

Theleb
31-05-2007, 02:20 PM
So get more +hit then...

Aye, did say that - and on the subject whats a good balance of hit/crit for Destro?

Dreadling
31-05-2007, 04:24 PM
Destro wins, End of discussion.

Yay!

Come out all you closet destro locks! XD

Also, in my kinda okish (nothing special) gear i have 100 odd + hit and 27% crit, only 800 spell dmg with fel armour on though, but meh. It works for me :)

Dread

Corruption
31-05-2007, 10:03 PM
Im on 1011 spell damage with fel armor, 77 (i think) hit and 23.something% crit (28.something with Devastation). Thing is, im saying this when i respecced Demonology some hours ago to get our arena team rating back up :S not forever though! I will return to the real spec soon enough.

Psonica
01-06-2007, 07:11 AM
I made a rehash of my gear the last week (and a lucky drop or so) going from 77 hit rating to like 125 hit rating and in retrospect I think it would have been worth it even if it would have gimped other stats in a small way. Having less resists = more damage. Affliction though. But yes +hit is great ... more dps and higher manaefficiency.

Armory: http://armory.wow-europe.com/#character-sheet.xml?r=Shadowsong&n=Psonica

Dreadling
04-06-2007, 04:01 PM
Think its about 17 or 18% to hit you need for a guaranteed hit against a boss nowadays, which seems kinda difficult without suppression. I soppose you dont really need guaranteed hits, and ofc normal mobs dnt need so much.

Yeah, being mana-inefficient is annoying :( I have imp life tap which helps a bit, and considering getting the cataclysm talent, which would help a bit.

Psonica
05-06-2007, 07:34 AM
But (as rehashed over and over again in another forum) even though I'm affliction a whoopin' 30-40% of my damage comes from Shadow Bolts which aren't even affected by the Supression talent (neither is Banish and Soulshatter - and you do NOT want to have that resisted - ever). So, in short: aim for 16% +spellhit from gear and use the talentpoints for something else.

Faylin
05-06-2007, 07:58 AM
Aim for 16% if you are raiding that is, as it's only needed for +3 lvl (boss level) mobs.

Difficulty with destro might obviously be that you also have crit to aim for, where as with affliction it's basically just spelldamage and hit you need.

Corruption
05-06-2007, 11:31 AM
Its possible to switch weapons around mid combat you know? :P
As in, its also possible to switch to a 2hander with a good amount of +hit and a wand with good +hit or a 1hander and an offhand with +hit to Soulshatter then switch back.

One Handers (http://www.thottbot.com/?f=w&name=&loc=Main+Hand&minrl=70&maxrl=&minl=&maxl=&mind=&maxd=&mins=&maxs=&stat1=23&c1=gt&v1=&stat2=&c2=gt&v2=&stat3=&c3=gt&v3=&e=)
Off Hand (http://www.thottbot.com/?f=a&loc=Held+In+Off-hand&name=&minrl=70&maxrl=&minl=&maxl=&stat1=23&c1=gt&v1=&stat2=&c2=gt&v2=&stat3=&c3=gt&v3=&stat4=&c4=gt&v4=&stat5=&c5=gt&v5=&e=)
Two Hand (http://www.thottbot.com/?f=w&name=&loc=Two-Hand&minrl=70&maxrl=&minl=&maxl=&mind=&maxd=&mins=&maxs=&stat1=23&c1=gt&v1=&stat2=&c2=gt&v2=&stat3=&c3=gt&v3=&e=)
Wands (http://www.thottbot.com/?f=w&skill=Wand&name=&minrl=70&maxrl=&minl=&maxl=&mind=&maxd=&mins=&maxs=&stat1=23&c1=gt&v1=&stat2=&c2=gt&v2=&stat3=&c3=gt&v3=&e=)

Corruption
05-06-2007, 11:33 AM
So, in short: aim for 16% +spellhit from gear and use the talentpoints for something else.

I kind of agree with you there also, as most Affliction spells you cast will most likely be things such as Corruption, Curse of Agony/Shadows/Elements etc, which are instant casts. Ofc, you loose a bit of damage time if one of these instant casts are resisted, but its hardly an issue to reapply them if they resist due to you not having Supression.

Zarcon
12-09-2007, 08:00 AM
I always found this a intresting read, BT raiding lock with Lolguard, the result may surprice some.
http://www.wowmb.net/forums/showthread.php?t=17405

Theleb
12-09-2007, 08:53 AM
Oh aye, Good Old Nyar.

I've been keeping an eye on that post for a while and indeed, it was suprising.

Hoshingen
13-09-2007, 08:15 AM
7 / 11 / 41 Destro lock, love it :).

Emperio
13-09-2007, 10:28 PM
In the lost few months ive been going with the following 2 builds.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=IZ0xI0IczZxx0tr0tVuV
Destruction, high extra dmg

and

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=IVZbxIzIVz0xsZxx0tr0z
Demonology, high +spelldmg

Both with an improved VW for easy grinding when not raiding.
The Destruction build has an slighty higher DPS output when sacking succubus then the Demonology build.
But with the demonology build you can keep your minion alive, could be nice for the raid benefits, and of course for yourself aswell (because of MD talent) the 20% dmg taken by minion with SL activated might help in survivability aswell

Ive you know a better lock PvE build post it !

~art

Theleb
14-09-2007, 02:42 AM
A lot depends on gear and playstyle...most of the serious endgame guilds have locks with different builds for raid synergy (like, 21/40 destro for ISB uptime, Couple with Deep Affliction for Shadow Embrace and Malediction, differing amounts of imp HS) so having one "great" build for locks has given way to a more raid-focused approach first and doing huge personal DPS second.

vattghern
14-09-2007, 09:06 AM
0/21/40 just doesn't cut it till a certain gear level. Solely for the ease of reaching hit cap and increasing pure damage (or shadow damage), Affliction is the way to go for a long long time.

Joortje
22-09-2007, 03:48 PM
And dont forget for 0/21/40 to be really effective you should be able to sac your pet for the +15 % fire/shadow damage. If you need to have your imp up, well.... ;-)

Corruption
23-09-2007, 09:54 AM
And dont forget for 0/21/40 to be really effective you should be able to sac your pet for the +15 % fire/shadow damage. If you need to have your imp up, well.... ;-)

I found sacrificing the felhunter for +3% mana/4sec to be better in some cases, with ~9k mana it equates to about 270 mana every 4 seconds which is bloody good. The shadow damage is awesome though especially if paired with a spriest in your group for the mana regen

Psonica
23-09-2007, 10:57 AM
Since when does warlocks get shadowpriest luvin' that often :P

Theleb
23-09-2007, 11:41 AM
Since when does warlocks get shadowpriest luvin' that often :P

Not as often as we should...

Danzig
27-09-2007, 12:25 PM
Have an idea of going

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=IV0bZfx00cZVx0tr0tAzVo

I would go for 0/21/40 but kind of like my shadowfury. I know its not the optimal specc but its alot of fun and I can't help liking firepewpew.

vattghern
27-09-2007, 01:29 PM
Okay. Why Nether Protection over Backlash? Also what your main school will be?

Danzig
27-09-2007, 01:43 PM
I was kind of thinking like backlash is nice but if I do my job in 5 mans (That is what I mostly do, not raiding) I never will be hit anyways, and if I get hit, it may not be a good idea to give another incernate, since if I do I most likely will have that mob glued on me.

Nether protection has helped me some in 5 mans if you nuke a untanked caster down so thats why I choose it.

Right now I go for Spellfireset, so fire will be my main school I guess. EDIT ( Ofc I mean spellfire, just tired and confused )

I know its not the ultimate dps specc but the playstyle it offers suits me and I really enjoy it, and I think with the right gear, I will be able to dish out some dps.

Aram
27-09-2007, 02:21 PM
But dont forget you get 1% crit rate for each pt. in Backlash too. And crit is what you need as a destro lock when you do instances.

vattghern
27-09-2007, 02:23 PM
Backlash is additional 3% crit. As far as defence goes, you have Shadowfury for instance. Regarding those untanked casters CoT them or just plainly fear them if you really have to hit untanked mob.

edit2: I assume you mean Spellfire set?

Danzig
27-09-2007, 02:28 PM
Yes. I have to agree on that when you say it. So away with Nether Prot, and in with Backlash. :) Yepp, spellfire, not spellstrike.

I was thinking of the imp imp talent, and maybe Fel intellect is more useful?

vattghern
27-09-2007, 02:59 PM
Actually it depends if you run with Imp or any other pet. My assumption is that you run with Imp and as you mentioned, you are instancing so I highly doubt that 3% more mana (that would be 300 on 10k mana pool) will be more worthwhile than 30% more stamina from Blood Pact for your party.

Danzig
27-09-2007, 03:09 PM
Mostly using imp yes, and I guess the 30% extra stamina actually are the same or more mana with life tap. Thanks for the help.

Missaar
29-06-2008, 03:50 PM
The way you solo content as a warlock is so heavily dependent on playstyle and gear. I personally like farming as destro 0/21/40 and for me it is the best way to go but it requires good enough gear to kill mobs in 3 sb's/incinerate when none of them crit. 2 hits when you crit. Then sac your felhunter and grind forever without having any downtime, soul leech will heal you should you once in a while get hit.

Muqai
30-06-2008, 07:18 PM
Thank you for those awesome words, necro.

cest
30-06-2008, 10:59 PM
Thank you for those awesome words, necro.

im sure the OP will find them most useful.

Skan
02-07-2008, 06:43 AM
The way you solo content as a warlock is so heavily dependent on playstyle and gear. I personally like farming as destro 0/21/40 and for me it is the best way to go but it requires good enough gear to kill mobs in 3 sb's/incinerate when none of them crit. 2 hits when you crit. Then sac your felhunter and grind forever without having any downtime, soul leech will heal you should you once in a while get hit.


As I understand, you're better off sacrificing a voidwalker, and just tapping for mana.
Personally, I always favoured leveling with a fel guard, as it's tanking potential helped quite alot on some of the 2 man and 3 man quests; every so often even a 5 man.

Mischief
02-07-2008, 07:50 AM
I ran some guildies through ZF last night with a sacced blueberry and I couldn't life tap fast enough! OK, it was only ZF but regenerating 60 life every second plus multiple Siphon Lifes (21 HPS) and the occasional Drain Life (108 HPS) meant that I was only ever more than a couple of health off max when I tapped.

I'm definitely going to use this for farming primals in the future.