Log in

View Full Version : Mutilate


onime
19-12-2006, 08:40 PM
Dont know if anyone on Shadowsong tested this.
anyway i have been using this build since the PTR came out and i am quite fond of it

pro's
2,3 combo points for 60 energy
cold blood
seal of fate
vigor
imp poison (10% on poison prox (need poison for +50% dmg mutilate))
imp kidney shot (9% dmg on stunned mob by all attacks)
find weakenes (10% dmg after finishing move which i can keep up 100% of the time )
can spam evi and rupture

con's
only 28% crit
dmg isnt that high 1200~1300 MH 700~800 OH max crit
non crit 600 MH 500 OH
-5% hit
-50% dmg with OH
-5% crit
no AR/BF

build atm

Assassination Talents - 41 point(s)

# Improved Eviscerate - rank 3/3
# Malice - rank 5/5
# Ruthlessness - rank 3/3
# Improved Slice and Dice - rank 3/3
# Relentless Strikes - rank 1/1
# Lethality - rank 5/5
# Improved Poisons - rank 5/5
# Cold Blood - rank 1/1
# Improved Kidney Shot - rank 3/3
# Seal Fate - rank 5/5
# Vigor - rank 1/1
# Find Weakness - rank 5/5
# Mutilate - rank 1/1

Combat Talents - 5 point(s)

# Improved Gouge - rank 3/3
# Improved Sinister Strike - rank 2/2

Subtlety Talents - 5 point(s)

# Opportunity - rank 5/5

with this build ur REALLY in combo point heaven (i mean keeping SnD rupture up and take a evi at times)

the overall raid dps isnt that bad (exept for trash seeing they die to fast)
with resonable dps i mean 3th rogue on the dmg meter at patch (which is a boring dps fight if u ask me)

do note that i am using death's sting/pugio so u probally have to use the GM dirk to do the same dps (AP not calculated trying to get meaxxna fang OH)

meaxxna fang OH? because mutilate used both weapons dmg rang afaik

for pvp it really nice aswell

cheap shot (2 points) mutilate (4~5) wait for cheap shot to wear of kidney shot CB mutilate (evi would be beter but u dont have combo points at this moment also note this mutilate will do +69% dmg)
must ppl will be death by then if not then u can vanish cheap shot and start over

Krazur
19-12-2006, 10:21 PM
To make a long post short:
Mutilate pwns.

True story.

K~

Stabstalker
19-12-2006, 10:37 PM
15/8/28 > mutilate

2 shooters ftw

AnteroVipune
19-12-2006, 10:39 PM
Mutilate is more fun than Combat daggers in PVE atm. Combat daggers took a huge blow in dps when they nerfed weapon skill too.

ATM Mutilate is about same dps as Combat daggers in PVE and on some fights it even outperforms CDs.

All in all. Great specc for lvl60 imo, but combat daggers will pull ahead when people hit lvl70

onime
19-12-2006, 10:49 PM
Mutilate is more fun than Combat daggers in PVE atm. Combat daggers took a huge blow in dps when they nerfed weapon skill too.

ATM Mutilate is about same dps as Combat daggers in PVE and on some fights it even outperforms CDs.

All in all. Great specc for lvl60 imo, but combat daggers will pull ahead when people hit lvl70
totally agreed
15/41/5 will be pwn

Wersia
21-12-2006, 12:14 PM
Mutilate > Combat in PvP imo

Kathra
21-12-2006, 12:27 PM
I'll mutilate yo face in a minute...

Hongten
21-12-2006, 12:35 PM
To make a long post short:
Mutilate pwns.

True story.

K~
QFT

Hurtgen
21-12-2006, 10:15 PM
wasnt impressed, respecced a couple days later to get cloak of shadows/hemo, omg, wat warlock dots...

Manidim
21-12-2006, 11:27 PM
Mutilate wins, it pwns dps, I with perditions in main, crit about 1200-1500 on raids with only main hand, then add the off hand crit of 700 or so, and you're up in the same stats as my old backstabs and that is the lowest possible only for me, in other words, you also get a hell of a lot CP's and can keep SnD + many eviscerates up all the time.

AnteroVipune
22-12-2006, 05:52 AM
Well thats kinda the whole point of mutilate, fast combo point generation.
That's also the reason why it's that much more fun in raids.

vanroguesing
22-12-2006, 09:37 PM
wasnt impressed, respecced a couple days later to get cloak of shadows/hemo, omg, wat warlock dots...

Dude your gear sucks (No offence intended) Thats why you never liked it:D

Krazur
23-12-2006, 02:30 PM
wasnt impressed, respecced a couple days later to get cloak of shadows/hemo, omg, wat warlock dots...

Dude your gear sucks (No offence intended) Thats why you never liked it:D

Yup, it's quite gear-sensitive. Also the build you pick matters quite a lot. Someone from guild just specced 'something' to mutilate, and got even points in imp. backstab. And why-o-why didn't he like mutilate...

Now he specced the same build as I have and he loves it. Even though his gear sucks quite much too. :P

And indeed Ante, that's the reason why raiding is so much fun with Mutilate. :)
"oeh 4 combopoints" "Oeh 5 again!" "AND AGAIN" "wait, SND.." "WHOO 4 CB's already!"

Unlike backstab, where you had 5 after 30 fricking seconds...

K~

Senister
23-12-2006, 04:15 PM
Got 5 tier 1 and 3 tier 2 with peditions blade and corehounds tooth. Is this build worth anything with that kind of gear?

Krazur
23-12-2006, 05:37 PM
Our gear is pretty similar then, 5/8 bf, 3/8 ns, perdition's blade and CHT. But I use that as my 'city-gear', that's my gear for making me look damn sexy. My raidgear is totally different.

Buttttt, just to test if you could better go for crit then for attackpower, I tested my so called city-gear in our MC run past tuesday. It's a bit less damage then my normal raidgear, but I ended up second with total damage, with like 20K behind a mage. (And I'm a big slacker.)
So yes, your gear would be suitable for the build.

Don't expect miracles on trashmobs, because you still need to be behind your target, the targets die too fast for your combopoints to really matter, -and- your mutilate wont crit as often as backstab, so the damage while doing trash will be a bit lower then your sword-friends or then your old 15/31/5 build, but on bosses or trashmobs with a nice amount of HP your damage will be insane, if played correctly.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=iheboExoidVoZV

This is what I use, no impr. SS or Gouge, just pure for raiding. You can move the points from murder to Imp. SnD, but the combogeneration is so awesome that it's not a requirement to have Imp. SnD, unlike the classic combatdagger.

The points in gouge that Onima has gives you a bit more controll in PVP, but the opponents die so fast that it's not a real requirement either.

Oh, and be prepared to buy loads of poisons, I used 160 Deadly Poisons with only 8 evenings of raiding in 2 weeks.

K~

Hurtgen
24-12-2006, 12:00 AM
wasnt impressed, respecced a couple days later to get cloak of shadows/hemo, omg, wat warlock dots...

Dude your gear sucks (No offence intended) Thats why you never liked it:D

STFU noob, still out dps'd u in raids wen u were combat swords the other nite! >.< *ahem* t2, *cough*

and u were stealing all my hemo points. i think hemo shud jus apply to the rogue who applys it:P j/k

onime
26-12-2006, 05:08 PM
afaik the hunter stings are also seen as poisons so u dont need to take alot of deadly poison with u
this is also beter seeing deadly poison sucks when u have imp poison seein the proc rate will be 40% which is insanly nice and alot

and i wouldnt say mutilate needs good gear it just needs a good dagger MH and OH (both with high dmg ranges
(GM dirk/kingsfall/deathsting/meaxna fang))

and i prever using rupture over evi in pve seeing it doesnt get reduced by armor and if evi doesnt crit i doubt it would do more (do note i got 1k+ ap)

and i wouldnt lose imp SS if u where u there are enough trash/bosses where u sometimes pop a SS seeing u cant get at its back (heigan for example)
also the losing imp kidney shot looks bit drastic seeing it nice raid dps wise (stunable mob +9% dmg) and it pwns pvp
the imp gouge point would mabye me nice in quick recovery (seeing i miss percesion i feel like my finishers (rupture/evi) have a bad habit to miss)

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhecoxxsizVoMZV

would be my build if dropping imp gouge (which i wont i like pvp to much)
still 1 point left

Krazur
27-12-2006, 04:59 AM
afaik the hunter stings are also seen as poisons so u dont need to take alot of deadly poison with u
this is also beter seeing deadly poison sucks when u have imp poison seein the proc rate will be 40% which is insanly nice and alot


True, but I like to be sure myself too. Hunters slack, we know that. :P
Can't hurt to be 100% sure that you're mutilating a poisoned target.


and i wouldnt say mutilate needs good gear it just needs a good dagger MH and OH (both with high dmg ranges
(GM dirk/kingsfall/deathsting/meaxna fang))


Only easily attainable now is the GM dirk, and even then you still need quite a lot of time to get 2 HWL-weapons. Im glad I might have my first one today if the server is up, have too much of a real life to PVP 24/7. So to compensate the lack of damage you loose with not having those 4 daggers mentioned above, you can compensate it with the rest of your gear. BF/NS-level is decent enough for it. ;)


and i prever using rupture over evi in pve seeing it doesnt get reduced by armor and if evi doesnt crit i doubt it would do more (do note i got 1k+ ap)

Depends, on trash I rather eviscirate, because the mob wont outlive the 16 (if 5 points) seconds anyway. (not in BWL that is. AQ40/Naxx I dunno yet, we haven't done any serious attempts there.) On bosses you're right. And I have 1K+ AP too. ;)


and i wouldnt lose imp SS if u where u there are enough trash/bosses where u sometimes pop a SS seeing u cant get at its back (heigan for example)
also the losing imp kidney shot looks bit drastic seeing it nice raid dps wise (stunable mob +9% dmg) and it pwns pvp
the imp gouge point would mabye me nice in quick recovery (seeing i miss percesion i feel like my finishers (rupture/evi) have a bad habit to miss)

Good point again. But I barely use gouge in PVP (don't need it, the people die fast enough) and I don't use Sinister Strike often enough to make it 2 points worthwhile. And especially not for 1 boss that I might never see thanks to TBC. Let the swordrogues do that. :)


http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhecoxxsizVoMZV

would be my build if dropping imp gouge (which i wont i like pvp to much)
still 1 point left
Yup, I've seen that build ya. Looks good, a bit more aimed at the PVP-aspect of mutilate.

It's all a bit personal preference. Someone likes more control in a pvp-fight (imp. gouge), someone else likes their poisons to hit harder and more often in raids. (Sorry, but I love deadly poison in PVP too. And 20% more damage with all poisons? Yes plx!)

Dada,

Kraz~

AnteroVipune
27-12-2006, 05:54 AM
Our gear is pretty similar then, 5/8 bf, 3/8 ns, perdition's blade and CHT. But I use that as my 'city-gear', that's my gear for making me look damn sexy. My raidgear is totally different.

Buttttt, just to test if you could better go for crit then for attackpower, I tested my so called city-gear in our MC run past tuesday. It's a bit less damage then my normal raidgear, but I ended up second with total damage, with like 20K behind a mage. (And I'm a big slacker.)
So yes, your gear would be suitable for the build.

Don't expect miracles on trashmobs, because you still need to be behind your target, the targets die too fast for your combopoints to really matter, -and- your mutilate wont crit as often as backstab, so the damage while doing trash will be a bit lower then your sword-friends or then your old 15/31/5 build, but on bosses or trashmobs with a nice amount of HP your damage will be insane, if played correctly.

http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=iheboExoidVoZV

This is what I use, no impr. SS or Gouge, just pure for raiding. You can move the points from murder to Imp. SnD, but the combogeneration is so awesome that it's not a requirement to have Imp. SnD, unlike the classic combatdagger.

The points in gouge that Onima has gives you a bit more controll in PVP, but the opponents die so fast that it's not a real requirement either.

Oh, and be prepared to buy loads of poisons, I used 160 Deadly Poisons with only 8 evenings of raiding in 2 weeks.

K~

Eh, if that build is meant for raiding why not take Imp SnD? Even with Mutilate it's still a great talent and allows you to do more finishers than without it. More finishers = more find weaknesess = more mutilates that fall under the influence of find weakness = more damage. Just because you dont have DW specc doesn't mean you shouldn't use SnD.

Mistoria
27-12-2006, 11:04 AM
i'm yet to test this in a raid but a few days ago i respecced http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=fhecoEroidVoZV

Krazur
27-12-2006, 03:22 PM
<snip> away text </snip>

K~

Eh, if that build is meant for raiding why not take Imp SnD? Even with Mutilate it's still a great talent and allows you to do more finishers than without it. More finishers = more find weaknesess = more mutilates that fall under the influence of find weakness = more damage. Just because you dont have DW specc doesn't mean you shouldn't use SnD.


I keep using SnD, I'm not a total retard. :P

I'm still testing some things here and there, the 46/0/5 build I use was a first build. Wanted to test if I could 'miss' the Imp. SnD and go Murder instead, but I do miss it. :P

K~

vanroguesing
27-12-2006, 08:21 PM
wasnt impressed, respecced a couple days later to get cloak of shadows/hemo, omg, wat warlock dots...

Dude your gear sucks (No offence intended) Thats why you never liked it:D

STFU noob, still out dps'd u in raids wen u were combat swords the other nite! >.< *ahem* t2, *cough*

and u were stealing all my hemo points. i think hemo shud jus apply to the rogue who applys it:P j/k

Am combat fist nub! and i joined halfway threw that run!

onime
28-12-2006, 12:33 AM
can we plz top refering to each other as nubs ect.
just hugging the dps meter doesnt mean shit if ur a good rogue or not
seeing if u kill MT 2 target when everyone is kill 1 ofc u do more dmg seeing u dont have to switch mobs
or when u have really beter gear then someone else (and i am not talking about 2 or 3 itmes)

about the topic

i read something in this topic that caught my eye and i agree on some things
so i was kinda thinking about this build (srry if someone posted it an i over looked it i am kinda dreamy)
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=f0ecoExsizVozZV

Moomonde
28-12-2006, 12:41 AM
<snip> away text </snip>

K~

Eh, if that build is meant for raiding why not take Imp SnD? Even with Mutilate it's still a great talent and allows you to do more finishers than without it. More finishers = more find weaknesess = more mutilates that fall under the influence of find weakness = more damage. Just because you dont have DW specc doesn't mean you shouldn't use SnD.


I keep using SnD, I'm not a total retard. :P

I'm still testing some things here and there, the 46/0/5 build I use was a first build. Wanted to test if I could 'miss' the Imp. SnD and go Murder instead, but I do miss it. :P

K~

Bad Kraz!
You shouldn't lie to people like that.
Back in your cage.

Krazur
01-01-2007, 01:26 AM
<snip> away text </snip>

K~

Eh, if that build is meant for raiding why not take Imp SnD? Even with Mutilate it's still a great talent and allows you to do more finishers than without it. More finishers = more find weaknesess = more mutilates that fall under the influence of find weakness = more damage. Just because you dont have DW specc doesn't mean you shouldn't use SnD.


I keep using SnD, I'm not a total retard. :P

I'm still testing some things here and there, the 46/0/5 build I use was a first build. Wanted to test if I could 'miss' the Imp. SnD and go Murder instead, but I do miss it. :P

K~

Bad Kraz!
You shouldn't lie to people like that.
Back in your cage.

I didn't lie anywhere.. ;(

I respecced a bit, but no decent raids yet to test it..

And Onime, why 1 point in Imp. SS?

K~

onime
03-01-2007, 04:41 PM
uhm thought i left 1 point to spare must have miss click didnt really know a usefull talent to put the last point was thinking
swift feet or how every tthat talent was called but yeah

Krazur
08-01-2007, 04:30 PM
Ah oke :P

Im too lazy to show to what I respecced now tbh, but still mutilate. :)

LosKrazzoz~