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Undied
24-10-2006, 09:54 PM
Hiya, im a level 55 warrior and i have Destiny ATM but it is fast at killing but im not shore...
i have heard from my guild that Fury is faster for killing... what is better for leveling up and killing??

Thank's Undied!!

Onkelswe
24-10-2006, 11:04 PM
Dunno really, i didn't respec Fury untill way after I hit 60. It's more fun than arms thou :)

Flawless
25-10-2006, 08:10 AM
Arms, unless you have great gear fury won't be faster.

Arms is far more forgiving on equipment than fury is.

Fintan
25-10-2006, 08:19 AM
FURY FURY FURY FURY.

Flawless
25-10-2006, 09:29 AM
FURY FURY FURY FURY.... -.-

Fintan
25-10-2006, 09:32 AM
FURY FURY FURY FURY.... -.-

He'll enjoy himself more AND get to piss off healers at the same time. What's not to love?

Flawless
25-10-2006, 10:37 AM
FURY FURY FURY FURY.... -.-

He'll enjoy himself more AND get to piss off healers at the same time. What's not to love?the 24% miss rate, the fact your main attack bloodthrist hits for crap without a decent amount of AP, and pre-60 it won't be decent. The fact that one of the best things in the tree Flurry procs off crits, which is normally gimped before 60. Even if he used a two hander the same arguements apply, except your miss rate is 5%. Then again, why not just bite the bullet and go arms for decent damage output for leveling with.

Then at 60 respec where after you get decent gear they can be more comparable.

Ps. he never said anything about which is more fun, he just asked whats faster for leveling and killing with.

Fintan
25-10-2006, 10:45 AM
......

Go fury my son. Ignore the MS whores.

Flawless
25-10-2006, 10:52 AM
......

Go fury my son. Ignore the MS whores.Love your arguements for taking fury over MS at that level.

Ps. I'm spec'd fury so... hardly an MS whore.

Fintan
25-10-2006, 10:54 AM
I'm obviously not taking it seriously, chill. ;)

( GO FURY)

Flawless
25-10-2006, 10:58 AM
I'm obviously not taking it seriously, chill. ;)

( GO FURY)the guy asked a serious question, thus I responded seriously.
stop spamming crap.

Fintan
25-10-2006, 10:59 AM
Stop getting wound up about a question relating to an online game. It's not worth it.

Edit: But being serious as it seems to be the theme, seriously go protection/fury, grind your last xp from tanking instances. You'll gain hundreds of gold, new gear, friends and valuable experience.

Flawless
25-10-2006, 11:07 AM
Stop getting wound up about a question relating to an online game. It's not worth it.

Edit: But being serious as it seems to be the theme, seriously go protection/fury, grind your last xp from tanking instances. You'll gain hundreds of gold, new gear, friends and valuable experience.Im not getting wound up, you say that fury is better and have nothing to back up why... thus I said stop spamming crap.

Nor do you need protection for doing pre-raid instance either... :roll:

Fact of the matter is arms is better for pre-60 as your not gimping yourself. Due to the fact that 45% of your attack power is going to result in a crap hit.

Fintan
25-10-2006, 11:10 AM
Sigh I shall return to my initial point.

FURY FURY FURY FURY.

You *will* have more fun and it's better for grinding normal mobs. It worked for me, but no I'm not going to spam the maths of it at you, as on paper, MS is better.

Flawless
25-10-2006, 11:16 AM
Sigh I shall return to my initial point.

FURY FURY FURY FURY.

You *will* have more fun and it's better for grinding normal mobs. It worked for me, but no I'm not going to spam the maths of it at you, as on paper, MS is better.

Ms is better overall.

Bloodthrist never scales better than MS until 1000Ap unbuffed~
The lack of +hit increases time, your telling me you kill a mob faster with a 24% miss rate rather than 5%?
You do know alot of rage comes from white hits right?

Flurry is brilliant, it procs of crits. Your crit rate was good enough pre-60 to keep it up more than 50% of the time?


Ps, I'm just debating with you while sitting in college learning about spreadsheets, you know fun for the whole family ¬-¬

Ashborn
25-10-2006, 11:19 AM
Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight! Fight!

Fintan
25-10-2006, 11:21 AM
I finished my last couple of levels in instances and grinding the orcs in Burning Steppes. Crit gear isn't a problem, it's the lack of hp at that level that really gets you. Most of your damage as fury comes from white hits anyway, so the relatively less damage from Bloodthirst shouldn't be a problem. In fact, you'll be using a lot of your rage pummeling, intercepting and whatnot to stop your low hp from being blasted away, so bloodthirst isn't always the greatest option whilst levelling anyway.

One slow heavy smacking stick and a 1.8 or lower speed offhand and you will have no problem grinding. MS destroys your soul. :(

I feel for you btw, I don't start a new job for another week so I have an abundance of free time, which is rather apparent in this thread. :P

Flawless
25-10-2006, 11:32 AM
Ill agree with you on the lack of HP to a degree, but thats depending on the gear you choose. You know, Str/sta vs. str/agi vs. sta/agi.

Yes, alot of damage comes from white damage, i'm pretty sure its around the 50% mark is white damage, for fury or MS.

The relatively less damage from BT is a big deal. Not using your instant strike is complete waste, its an instant strike before then you had one, Whirlwind. the 31 pointers are an increase in DPS no matter what. As for rage for pummel and intercept... its 10 rage, nothing that one hit won't make up.

Anyway, going home now, ill continue this tomorrow!

Fintan
25-10-2006, 11:40 AM
As I said, on paper MS is definitely the better choice. From my personal experience however, I found fury to be far more accomodating for different styles of play and situations, whilst being damn good fun at the same time. I also found BS to do easily enough damage to grind comfortably to level 60, even with relatively little Attack Power. My overall choice would be protection/fury for 60 at any rate, protection helps a lot in Scholo etc, and you actually feel like a tank. :D

If you're willing to take speed-levelling to 60 over fun and the preservation of YOUR EVERLASTING SOUL, then I guess spec...eugh...arms. :(

Faylin
25-10-2006, 11:49 AM
I have to agree that Fury is just way more fun then MS, though the miss rate is very annoying.

But what is/has been much more annoying to me is the fact you're hitting a mob every 3.5 seconds with nothing to do in between. (except MS offc). Just feels so sloooow. Rage comes in big chunks, but also means that 1 miss makes you unable to do anything for 7 seconds.. which feels like aaaages, at least to me.. Also bloody annoying to see a mob at 3% and you're missing... dunno just meh.

I do have to agree with the arguements vs fury... flurry isn't up much due to low crit (enrage can be up lots though :)) and Bloodthirst ain't exactly uber with 600 AP.

Anyway.. go with personal taste in the end I guess... all specs will get you to 60 anyway :)

Kinshara
25-10-2006, 12:06 PM
Reminds me a bit of my paladin; I can be incredibly efficient and have no downtime, but be bored to tears due to not actually doing a whole lot, or I can burn mana like crazy and actually have some fun.

I would recommend experimenting a bit at least though, since you often won't know exactly what you will like until you've tried several builds/playstyles.

Faylin
25-10-2006, 12:10 PM
Judgement of Light, auto-attack, afk... been there done that ... horrible :(


"woot I killed a stone guardian.... in 3 minutes..."

Decebalus
25-10-2006, 12:16 PM
don't forget that Destiny it's a 2.60 speed 2h...

i would try a fury build with that...

Faylin
25-10-2006, 12:19 PM
... and has a fury friendly proc....

for me personally however it wouldn't change the fact that fighting with a 2H feels slow and boring :)

Abberare
25-10-2006, 12:23 PM
Loving MS for levelling at 49 atm, but I know Tak levelled his warrior with fury and seemed to go up pretty fast. It does suck waiting for attacks sometimes (especially when you miss) but then delivering a great big smash to the face makes up for it :)

Kinshara
25-10-2006, 04:24 PM
Judgement of Light, auto-attack, afk... been there done that ... horrible :(


"woot I killed a stone guardian.... in 3 minutes..."

Quite. hence me going for a holy nukefest when playing solo on the pally. I spend a fair chunk on getting water for mana, but it's a damn sight more interesting than autoattack with JoL and seal of casino alone.

(And if SoB doesn't make it cross faction... may be just the bloodknight I'm left with.
reliable damage with a slight /wrist > moderate chance-on-hit holy DoT)

Meri
25-10-2006, 05:00 PM
In my experience fury is faster when grinding just exp from 2-4 level lower mobs. MS is fun for big numbers and isnt much slower. OTOH MS absolutely requires a very good weapon. Then at level 55-60 (maybe already at 50) it's actually easier to find a good weapon than to keep your whole set good enough for fury.

edit: oh and I meant 2handed fury with fast main and offhanders.

Tsarina
25-10-2006, 05:12 PM
edit: oh and I meant 2handed fury with fast main and offhanders.
So 2 1handers, in other words.

Fast MH is pointless. Plenty of drawbacks, not a single advantage. You don't get more rage, you do less damage. If you have lifestealing or Firey weapon it might make some obscure kind of sense. It's still silly, though.

zanzanexpo
25-10-2006, 05:21 PM
fury is fast to grind levels if your grinding green level mobs, i leveled soley fury then respecced MS.
dont try grinding on yellow mobs, its lower xp per-hour then green mobs.

Chonar
26-10-2006, 07:51 AM
I dualwield in PVE and use a big axe with an eye in it for PVP.
The lack of the MS debuff in PVP made me forcefully become better at pummeling heals. Even though sometimes I still am late... damn global cooldowns.

Temmink
26-10-2006, 10:20 AM
edit: oh and I meant 2handed fury with fast main and offhanders.
So 2 1handers, in other words.

Fast MH is pointless. Plenty of drawbacks, not a single advantage. You don't get more rage, you do less damage. If you have lifestealing or Firey weapon it might make some obscure kind of sense. It's still silly, though.

Fast main hand is better for cleaving/heroic strike, as you 'waste' less rage. And it's better for unbridled wrath. (which might actually be a talent of importance in TBC with the rumoured rage nerf).

But yeah, this has been debated a million times on the warrior forums and it always resulted in mud throwing. It's mostly a personal preference really from what i could filter out of the theorycraft stuff. Sure, if you generate barely enough rage to only overpower,whirlwind and bloodthirst, slow main hand is the way to go. But with 65+ dps stuff, that's hardly an issue anymore.



Anyhow, my advice is to sell the Destiny and get a Reaper (or Icebarbed Spear if you wanna be cheap). Fury is balls without hella nice gear and besides, Mortal Strike sinks continents in pvp. So ignore the fury fags, go MS. Yeah baby. :twisted:

Cassina
31-10-2006, 02:19 PM
edit: oh and I meant 2handed fury with fast main and offhanders.
So 2 1handers, in other words.

Fast MH is pointless. Plenty of drawbacks, not a single advantage. You don't get more rage, you do less damage. If you have lifestealing or Firey weapon it might make some obscure kind of sense. It's still silly, though.

Fast main hand is better for cleaving/heroic strike, as you 'waste' less rage.

/roffles

There's a reason why many DW fury warriors consider Deathbringer (2.9 speed) to be the best main hand until late BWL.
Slower - harder hitting cleaves/whirlwind which makes it somewhat viable for PvP as well (and if you're using heroic strikes in raiding you're an idiot).
Still amazes me how people automatically think fast = fury!

And it's better for unbridled wrath. (which might actually be a talent of importance in TBC with the rumoured rage nerf).
Which is why you go with a faster weapon in offhand.

I found that for PvP a slow 2H weapon was still better than DW though because you can drop some +hit gear like Titanics which have sod all stamina and swap in some more items with more of it.

Taurusos
31-10-2006, 02:47 PM
"(and if you're using heroic strikes in raiding you're an idiot)."

You confuse me Cassina. Did you get a farmer to level your warrior?
See, you can use HS if you know how to control it.

Cassina is back.

/pat

/Tau

Cassina
31-10-2006, 02:50 PM
"(and if you're using heroic strikes in raiding you're an idiot)."

You confuse me Cassina. Did you get a farmer to level your warrior?
See, you can use HS if you know how to control it.

Cassina is back.

/pat

/Tau

Not really, since on a long fight you will gradually build up so much threat the tank won't be able to stay above you.
Besides, improved cleave is only slightly less damage without the built-in threat modifier - so which one to use? Hmm..hard question.

Don't get me wrong, it's fine in MC and lots of fights in AQ but I wouldn't be doing this on Ebonroc/Flamegor/Nef.

Thrane
31-10-2006, 02:54 PM
Slower - harder hitting cleaves/whirlwind which makes it somewhat viable for PvP as well

Because using the exact same gear as you do while dpsing in pvp is a must. You're not allowed to swap weapons. No sir.

So no... using a faster mainhand won't really matter much (unless on a dodge happy boss since you may end up overpowering a bit more there. Granted.. I'm a fan of slow mh/fast oh myself. But that doesn't mean two fast weapons is utter crap for dps. It will decrease a tad from slow MH/fast OH though. (mainly due to WF if your horde and on alliance due to HoJ. Else you won't notice much of a difference unless you're on a boss where you can spare to whirlwind a lot.)


Don't get me wrong, it's fine in MC and lots of fights in AQ but I wouldn't be doing this on Ebonroc/Flamegor/Nef.

Hi there aggro roof. Oh.. right .. you don't know any better.

Flawless
31-10-2006, 03:00 PM
"(and if you're using heroic strikes in raiding you're an idiot)."

You confuse me Cassina. Did you get a farmer to level your warrior?
See, you can use HS if you know how to control it.

Cassina is back.

/pat

/Tau

/celebrate

Warrior forum just got that much better.

Cassina
31-10-2006, 03:03 PM
/sigh
Yeah I'm back, but on my gearless-shaman.
Repping him up in BGs to get some gear back, then going to hit TBC with DW (13% hit from talents is pretty nice ;) )

Offa
31-10-2006, 05:08 PM
i was always more of a fan of the 2h fury build myself, rather than this dual wielding nonsense :)

not having to spend points in dual wield spec is rather nice, frees them up for other things

Kinshara
31-10-2006, 05:40 PM
/sigh
Yeah I'm back, but on my gearless-shaman.
Repping him up in BGs to get some gear back, then going to hit TBC with DW (13% hit from talents is pretty nice ;) )

9% now isn't it? (DW specialization got nerfed to 6% for 3 talent points max)

Cassina
01-11-2006, 09:31 AM
*checks*

Dammit they did too, ah well.
http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/info/classes/bc-shaman/talents.html?0000000000000000000050052301050213053 110025030351004010000000

Ogrosh
01-11-2006, 11:40 AM
/sigh
Yeah I'm back, but on my gearless-shaman.
Repping him up in BGs to get some gear back, then going to hit TBC with DW (13% hit from talents is pretty nice ;) )

9% now isn't it? (DW specialization got nerfed to 6% for 3 talent points max)

heh, I was gonna say the same thing. It's not soo bad though, DW Shaman were doing way too much damage before and always pulling aggro, most people are happy about the changes from what I have seen.

Temmink
01-11-2006, 12:16 PM
edit: oh and I meant 2handed fury with fast main and offhanders.
So 2 1handers, in other words.

Fast MH is pointless. Plenty of drawbacks, not a single advantage. You don't get more rage, you do less damage. If you have lifestealing or Firey weapon it might make some obscure kind of sense. It's still silly, though.

Fast main hand is better for cleaving/heroic strike, as you 'waste' less rage.

/roffles

There's a reason why many DW fury warriors consider Deathbringer (2.9 speed) to be the best main hand until late BWL.


The reason being it has a stupid amount of dps which won't be surpassed by anything up until, what, late BWL?

Moriartus
01-11-2006, 12:26 PM
Dude cassina heroic strike is a fine rage dump in raids. If you're taking AoE damage or just for no apparent reason a lot of damage you end up with like 100 rage and you can't dispose of it with mortal strike and if you don't use it you lose it after the battle. The cooldowns on whirlwind and MS don't allow you to use it enough to get rid of masses of rage so heroic strike is another almost MS damage attack that you can use your excess rage on.

Fintan
01-11-2006, 02:05 PM
Heroic Strike in raids makes Fintan die.

Chonar
01-11-2006, 02:16 PM
You r teh ned bettar tnak.

Utena
01-11-2006, 02:23 PM
Dunno I end up spamming the shit out of HS in raids sometimes, cant remember running into too many problems...

Fintan
01-11-2006, 02:23 PM
We have some pretty awesome tanks actually. I just need to install threat-meters, as I have zero clue if the next attack is going to pull aggro or not. I could just stop using deathwish but that would be so Un-Dwarvish. :(

Kenny
03-11-2006, 02:48 AM
L2managethreat!

Tsarina
03-11-2006, 03:09 AM
Don't get me wrong, it's fine in MC and lots of fights in AQ but I wouldn't be doing this on Ebonroc/Flamegor/Nef.That's interesting. Those fights are the ones I use HS in. Vs Chromaggus too. I guess your tanks need to lrn2play.

Dude cassina heroic strike is a fine rage dump in raids. If you're taking AoE damage or just for no apparent reason a lot of damage you end up with like 100 rage and you can't dispose of it with mortal strike and if you don't use it you lose it after the battle. The cooldowns on whirlwind and MS don't allow you to use it enough to get rid of masses of rage so heroic strike is another almost MS damage attack that you can use your excess rage on.Obviously you use Cleave if aggro is an issue. And it is in some fights.

We have some pretty awesome tanks actually. I just need to install threat-meters, as I have zero clue if the next attack is going to pull aggro or not. I could just stop using deathwish but that would be so Un-Dwarvish. :(Clearly you don't. I spam HS in most bossfights and hardly ever get aggro (I could say never, but it happens if off-tanks messes up wingbuffet taunting and on Razorgore where I just don't care too much). Why is that? I have lower DPS than you? Not for quite some time, young man. Must be that Blood Elf BoS kicking in early :p
Make your tanks work harder. Or better. Or get better gear. More +str helps a lot. Too many tanks walk around with agi/stam and are proud of how much damage they can soak up while the boss turns around for little Fintan.
(In other words: What Chonar said.)

Cassina
03-11-2006, 08:28 AM
Don't get me wrong, it's fine in MC and lots of fights in AQ but I wouldn't be doing this on Ebonroc/Flamegor/Nef.That's interesting. Those fights are the ones I use HS in. Vs Chromaggus too. I guess your tanks need to lrn2play.

Those fights can last a while though, so the longer you are using HS the more likely you will catch up to your tanks in aggro.
Chrom is fine to spam HS all you want since you will either be running out of LOS at regular intervals or getting the aggro drop from time lapse anyway.

And then we come to the other reason for using a slow MH, if you are using HS with a fast weapon you'll be doing a silly amount of threat per sec for someone who's supposed to be DPSing.

Taurusos
03-11-2006, 11:41 AM
Don't get me wrong, it's fine in MC and lots of fights in AQ but I wouldn't be doing this on Ebonroc/Flamegor/Nef.That's interesting. Those fights are the ones I use HS in. Vs Chromaggus too. I guess your tanks need to lrn2play.

Those fights can last a while though, so the longer you are using HS the more likely you will catch up to your tanks in aggro.
Chrom is fine to spam HS all you want since you will either be running out of LOS at regular intervals or getting the aggro drop from time lapse anyway.

And then we come to the other reason for using a slow MH, if you are using HS with a fast weapon you'll be doing a silly amount of threat per sec for someone who's supposed to be DPSing.

Lemme ask one thing Ebay warrior. You go against warriors that are far better than yourself and more experienced. Lilska, Thrane, myself and others. Your posts so far on these forums have shown that Cassina. The ever so popular "How 2 AP as fury lolz" and now this.

Ever, ever, ever oh ever did it occur to you that warriors actually use different attacks than one?

Meaning you dont have to use HS all the time?

In a raid situation you use HS at certain times, to maybe get your rage gen moving to get it to a point where you have rolling BTs for example (enough rage gen to only do ONE hs per BT) and dump rage through WW.

Are you being stubborn to give up your totally moot point?

Dont lurk forums and read what people tell you.

Think out of the box and experience and try stuff yourself.

/Tau

malkor
03-11-2006, 12:11 PM
im a MS whore n love it, big crits, shit dies fast, but why o why does everything in AQ resist glimpse of madness :/

Thrane
03-11-2006, 12:33 PM
im a MS whore n love it, big crits, shit dies fast, but why o why does everything in AQ resist glimpse of madness :/

They're already affected by it!!! Y'know... glimpse of madness being C'Thun's influence and they kind of already being his minions :P

malkor
03-11-2006, 12:35 PM
So outside of AQ its all good then? instance wise. not been anywhere else yet to find out :P

Thrane
03-11-2006, 12:44 PM
So outside of AQ its all good then? instance wise. not been anywhere else yet to find out :P

You do realise I was making that up right? :P If that was true you'd be getting immune messages :P (it is possible they have a higher resist rate in there dno... proc seemed to do the trick when chon was testing it when he first got it.)

malkor
03-11-2006, 01:32 PM
Well it did make sense tho :P used it last night and everything was immune except the non elites in the respawn tunnel, and clearing scarabs after emps. unless i was just unlucky with getting it to proc

Fintan
03-11-2006, 07:22 PM
(In other words: What Chonar said.)

Except you feel the need to condescend whilst your doing it. I'm quite happy to listen to advice from experienced DPS warriors or general experienced raiders, but do you have to be a patronising cretin in the process?

What I'll take away from this is to refine my own DPS output with some new threat meters until I get a feel for when I'm going overboard, it's a little too easy to blame someone else without properly investigating your own actions, especially as the rest of the raid seems to cope fine. If anyone could reccommend a reliable threat meter that would be great.

Utena
03-11-2006, 09:03 PM
KTM isnt too bad

Kzuhl
03-11-2006, 10:06 PM
I reckon you can safely use HS as a rage dump when WW and BT are on cd in most fights. If you are afraid of getting aggro on Ebonroc or Flamegor you can just take a Wingbuffet and whack away again. Nef is a fight where I'd be a bit careful, though.

On almost all other fights beyond that I can think of (where you won't be needed as OT and can safely DPS balls-out), there's a gimmick that makes aggro-management moot anyway.

And yes, KTM isn't too bad, but not reliable. I've pulled aggro before, although KTM didn't show me as having created more threat than the other person I tried to stay below.

Kinshara
03-11-2006, 10:41 PM
Except you feel the need to condescend whilst your doing it. I'm quite happy to listen to advice from experienced DPS warriors or general experienced raiders, but do you have to be a patronising cretin in the process?

How else do we get tasty drama? :)

Tsarina
05-11-2006, 01:10 PM
do you have to be a patronising cretin in the process?
I have so much to learn from you, Mr. Courteous. Please tutor me in the ways of polite forum posting.
Every time you open your egotistical mouth, I just want to punch it, really fucking hard.



What I'll take away from this is to refine my own DPS output with some new threat meters until I get a feel for when I'm going overboard, it's a little too easy to blame someone else without properly investigating your own actions, especially as the rest of the raid seems to cope fine. If anyone could reccommend a reliable threat meter that would be great.KTM, as mentioned, is very nice. In most fights the one on top is the one with aggro.
I think you should blame the rest of the raid, tbh. If you keep pulling aggro, but the warlocks don't, they are slacking. I'm not saying that a warlock not drawing aggro necessarily is a slacker, but since you seem to have a problem with it (and you shouldn't if the tanks produced enough threat), they should have too.
If the good tanks in Swarm were tanking, I never got aggro unless I did something silly. But we had some tanks that seemed to lose aggro as soon as I looked at a mob. Still good tanks in most aspects of their role, but they just don't make the mob hate them enough. Mostly a gear issue. Something that can be solved partially with DPS. Mongoose/juju stuff works great for holding aggro. Inspect your tanks and their buffs.

Fintan
05-11-2006, 01:30 PM
Yes and I apologised for that particular outburst. It was also anger as oppose to your constant, unjustified superiority complex.

I'll definitely look into KTM, but it's been a couple of months since I've had the chance to do raid DPS so almost like a fresh start. Tom make that computer work you git. :(

Utena
05-11-2006, 01:30 PM
And yes, KTM isn't too bad, but not reliable. I've pulled aggro before, although KTM didn't show me as having created more threat than the other person I tried to stay below.

No it isnt perfect, but then what is... its not someting that should be relied upon too heavily, but when used in conjunction with your own judgement you should never get into any problems.

Onkelswe
05-11-2006, 02:20 PM
Wtf happened to this thread? ^^

Flawless
05-11-2006, 02:35 PM
Wtf happened to this thread? ^^it got owned :P

Kzuhl
05-11-2006, 05:51 PM
No it isnt perfect, but then what is... its not someting that should be relied upon too heavily, but when used in conjunction with your own judgement you should never get into any problems.

Yes, but you should also never be able to absolutely maximise your performace as a dps class, because your own judgement isn't going to tell you how your tank is performing, whether he has a miss-streak on his threat styles or w/e in a given fight. That's something communication and long experience with your MT has to do for you. But ofc that's something you need to live with.
The bottom line still is, you cannot absolutely trust KTM simply because it's not working exactly.

Utena
05-11-2006, 05:56 PM
That's something communication and long experience with your MT has to do for you. But ofc that's something you need to live with.


That comes under own judgement if you ask me...

GÃ¥ile
07-11-2006, 04:55 PM
Arms, For those who like BIG :D

Artia
08-11-2006, 07:17 AM
Ah typo in sigs, I love those in the morning.

Faylin
08-11-2006, 08:33 AM
Ah typo in sigs, I love those in the morning.

damn took me a while to find it. Think it's a quite common typo.

Flawless
08-11-2006, 09:29 AM
Myeah, found it!

This is a fun game

Akrea
08-11-2006, 10:26 AM
it is, yeah, took like a minute before i got it, but i do think it is rather common.

Jarelan
08-11-2006, 12:57 PM
Can't remember if I posted here or now :) Can't be arsed looking through 5 pages.

I had been 2h from lvl 35 onwards when i got my whirlwind axe. At 60 I got my Arcanite Reaper and my PvP gear. That gear gave crappy attack power but nice crits and I had fun. Then I got the Untamed Blade and same thing...

I'd always thought about trying fury, but 2 things held me back. One was a lack of 2 good swords and 2nd was my shitty atk power and chance to hit.

I'd been holding onto a CTS for 6 months, then a QR dropped off Fank and I decided to go for it, at that point my attack power was getting respectable 850 or so. Over the last 3 weeks i have been gathering more str/atk power gear and +hit gear. Now I stand at 970 atk power unbuffed (1260 with BS) and I have +5 to hit (still looking for more). I've lost my crit chance a bit, but it isn't that noticable.

I'm loving fury right now, but I know I couldn't have gone for it earlier as my gear just would've gimped me and MS spec was the only way, it's a lot more forgiving for weaker gear.

Onkelswe
08-11-2006, 10:13 PM
Ah typo in sigs, I love those in the morning.

Spotted it in 2 sec. Now what do i win? I hope its pr0n-related.

Edit: Can't say my sig is all that grammaticly correct either, but that's another story. :)

Dinmomz
09-11-2006, 02:06 AM
Hmm... are you guys actually using HS everytime you get the chance? (ie have rage enough) If i do that i draw aggro in a flash :evil:

I tend to go with cleave, BT and WW pretty much every swing/cd with a few HS's every now and then. (altho i dont get to dps much :( )

ps. and i use fast weapons 8) (i do have Deathbringer but i rarely use it anymore)

edit.
about KTM... last time we used it as a raid our OT (Taram) got a negative threat all the time... and still managed to keep aggro. So it has a few problems :lol:

Ashborn
09-11-2006, 03:16 AM
I tend to go with cleave, BT and WW pretty much every swing/cd with a few HS's every now and then. (altho i dont get to dps much :( )
Not a warrior, but far as I know the most effective way is to always keep enough rage to bt + ww the second they're out of cooldown, and throw in just enough hs's so you never hit 100 rage. Also, cleave actually does more threat per damage added than hs (cleave threat: total damage + 490, adds 50 damage, hs threat: total damage + 890, adds 157 damage), so you'd be better off using less hs's and wasting rage than you'd be spamming cleave. Also if threat is an issue you should use a slow weapon, more rage lost per hs (which isn't an issue if you'd be wasting rage anyhow), and more damage for ww, which does no extra threat.

(Note: threat numbers come from a very quick and dirty google search, feel free to correct me on those if they're wildly off)

Dinmomz
09-11-2006, 03:39 PM
well the thing is, when i dps i usually generate enough rage to do both WW and BT every cd and cleave almost every swing. Using HS every swing is out of the question (i use a 2.3 speed MH).

And i tried changing my neffie axe for Deathbringer and use more HS's (at first it was because i like 1,5k 1hand crits :) ) but my dps dropped down quite a bit.

ps. i cant say ive really tried anything much... just in MC a few times. I get to tank in most other instances

Faylin
09-11-2006, 04:04 PM
(cleave threat: total damage + 490, adds 50 damage, hs threat: total damage + 890, adds 157 damage), so you'd be better off using less hs's and wasting rage than you'd be spamming cleave.

Cleave has additional threat? I didn't know :shock:

Ashborn
09-11-2006, 05:14 PM
well the thing is, when i dps i usually generate enough rage to do both WW and BT every cd and cleave almost every swing. Using HS every swing is out of the question (i use a 2.3 speed MH).

And i tried changing my neffie axe for Deathbringer and use more HS's (at first it was because i like 1,5k 1hand crits :) ) but my dps dropped down quite a bit.
The dps loss would be because crully is far superior to deathbringer, speed is only really an issue when you have two weapons with very similar dps and stats (afaik). Also, hs'ing every second swing should get you more added damage for about the same amount of extra threat as cleaving on every swing, even if you lose rage due to hitting 100.

Senister
09-11-2006, 09:18 PM
Man im glad im no warrior... too many things to take into moderation.

Faylin
09-11-2006, 09:25 PM
Yeh, it's funny... you would think a warrior is all about brute force.. but actually I think rage management is harder then that of mana and energy ... :)

Cassina
11-11-2006, 03:48 AM
I'm loving fury right now, but I know I couldn't have gone for it earlier as my gear just would've gimped me and MS spec was the only way, it's a lot more forgiving for weaker gear.

Hehe, a convert.

By the way, I've been testing HS threat with KTM lately, and it seems to be ok.
The extra DPS appears to be worth the risk as long as you have salv, and an MT with a TF never hurt either.

Although I did pull aggro at the emps the other night on execute stage (using 2 tanks strat), which was a bit of a heart stopper, but I just got one shotted then he went back to the MT and all was well thank god.

Stim
12-11-2006, 04:09 PM
Me, hungry and poor Orc warrior in weaklings guild -> only way to get cool stuff - bg rep/honor grind. So: Two epic weapons for dual fury? Impossible! One epic weapon for MS whoring? TUF, right away, sir! (plus I can't say NO to those sweet overpowers-> makes me kill epixx rogues).