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Alia
18-04-2006, 10:36 AM
I have a little lvl14 Cute Shaman cow on SS but she is not high enough for me to understand the Shaman class issues...other then the bug that make u die( sorry bad joke ).

Now as both Mage and Shaman changes are going to be in the same patch, I would like to have a clear view on how big is your issues/bugs and their effect on your game play, this might show how big each class part of the new patch is going to be, in term of amount of changes.

I have been seeking info like this in the Shaman forums but almost all the posted are filled with trolls( no offence for the troll population ), whiners and nerf posts.

I hope that those will not happen here, Thank u.

Cassina
18-04-2006, 11:27 AM
- Respeccing causes you to lose ALL skill points in 2H weapons so you have to grind it up from 1 to 300.
- Stormstrike is crap for a 31 point talent.
- Totem talents are generally useless (imp grace of air is ok though).
- Most resto talents are not worth it, many shamans choose to go 0/30/21 or 31/0/20 (or 30/0/21 for NS).

Ruargh
18-04-2006, 01:30 PM
that about sums it up yes, and some buggy totems.
otherwise its sorta ok :)

Azelton
18-04-2006, 01:37 PM
Also the fact that shamans have some problems when it comes to end game raiding. The abilities and talens and not totally up to par with the shaman role as a support class.

Ruargh
18-04-2006, 01:44 PM
ow btw, not much of a bug but something that can be sorta annoying... totems in general: to short of a duration sometimes and the range can be very annoying at certain encounters...

but that might just be me ^^

Sethanon
18-04-2006, 02:49 PM
- Respeccing causes you to lose ALL skill points in 2H weapons so you have to grind it up from 1 to 300.
- Stormstrike is crap for a 31 point talent.
- Totem talents are generally useless (imp grace of air is ok though).
- Most resto talents are not worth it, many shamans choose to go 0/30/21 or 31/0/20 (or 30/0/21 for NS).

i saw a vid of a shaman one shotting people with stormstrike : /

Harr
18-04-2006, 03:14 PM
Yeah like all shammies have hand of ragnaros :P
(and winfury (propably) has same 20% chance proccing on that)

Cassina
18-04-2006, 04:48 PM
- Respeccing causes you to lose ALL skill points in 2H weapons so you have to grind it up from 1 to 300.
- Stormstrike is crap for a 31 point talent.
- Totem talents are generally useless (imp grace of air is ok though).
- Most resto talents are not worth it, many shamans choose to go 0/30/21 or 31/0/20 (or 30/0/21 for NS).

i saw a vid of a shaman one shotting people with stormstrike : /

And I've seen a video of a mage using these two trinkets one-sho.. oh wait, that's like nearly every mage. :lol:

*Yes I know it's been nerfed but you get the point.

Elexin
18-04-2006, 04:56 PM
Previous people have summed it up fairly shortly and sweetly... but I like long posts, so I had to write one :)


The thing is we're not only concerned with bugs, we're also concerned with talents.
In the same way as mages actually.

If in your review they turned round and said "Hey, we finally made arcane missiles work, and you no longer blink and fail to move... thats your review" you'd probably be a bit annoyed ;)


The main bugs are things like the skill resets on two handed weapons (as using them is talent based) and Stormstrike bugging and incorrectly using charges.

((Personally I'll also put in here that Tremor Totems range is reported as 30 yards when infact its about 10yards, and that Shaman Totems still do not stack with other classes buffs - mainly meaning druids and mark of the wild here, but if you want Hunter aura of nature also applies ))

On top of that there are things that we really hope are bugs (at the moment since the last patch, totems die to aoe effects. The shaman class page states that "Totems are immune to area effect spells"... but as mages know, Blizzard are more than capable of modifying class pages)
This affects us pretty badly, with bosses such as Ragnaros erasing all our totems in one go with his aoe attacks, or Onyxia's lava eruptions having the same effect.

Our totems cost too much mana and last such a short time already (most are around a minute in length, some are substantially less), that making something else kill them, and kill all of them, means that it can seem rather a pointless waste of time putting them up in the first place.
Not to mention that buff totems have a fixed 30yard range that you can only increase by wearing 3 bits of EF (for buff totems only, offensive totems can't have their range increased)

The other gripe is that the scale of AQ fights makes Totems pointless because of the fixed range.
Also, the totems draw agro from bugs and such in AQ40 and can cause nasty wipes.


The rest is talent complaints;
There are countless numbers of pointless talents associated with totems/
As I said before, Totems cost a lot, don't last long enough, and with one exception they all have 5hp.
Buffing them is a waste of points, so we have less choice.

In the Elemental Tree you'll see most of the utterly pointless Totem talents, nearly all associated with fire totems except Imp. stoneclaw totem. (Stoneclaw totem is a 'taunting' totem... however it cannot taunt anything off you if you have even a smidgen of existing agro)

The enchancement tree starts off well but ends up with points for skills that rarely get used (how often do you see shamans waving flametongue or frostbrand weaponry, really?), and its generally believed that stormstrike is not worth it as an end tree talent.
There is also very little itemisation for Enhancment shamans at 'endgame'


I'll let Elemental or Enhancement shamans field any further questions about those, they're not my area of expertise ;)

The resto tree is poorly designed. Most consider it pointless to go past Natures Swiftness, and if you want a true healing build for minimal points you go purification and avoid the eventide totem talent structure like the plague.

To get the 'end tree' talent of Mana Tide (which is poorly designed and scales poorly with increasing mana pools) you have to waste 10 points in totem talents first, which prevents you getting the useful talents without seriously destroying your capabilities outside of raids.

Also, unlike other healers, we also have no way to reduce our agro from healing



Many shamans also feel they have little use endgame, as our totems do not compare to paladin buffs (no flames, I'm just stating it as a fact; Blessing of Kings has no horde counterpart, Blessing of Wisdoms counterpart offers a grand 14mana per few seconds for less than a minute, Salvations counterpart is a lesser 20% reduction... I'm sure people can list others aswell)

On top of this, our buffs are restricted to one buff per totem... So if we want mana regeneration we cannot have fire resistance, poison cleansing and so on, if we want agro reduction we cannot use agility, windfury or nature resistance totems.

They are restricted by range (most buff totems have the 30yard range, tremor totem is reported as 30yards but I beleive its actually 10yards)

They last less time (at most, a little over a minute) and are very mana heavy, especially to say we have to replace them many times during a fight

They have a grand 5hp, and currently all sorts of things destroy them meaning we have to waste even more mana if our parties expect them back. The mana management of parties wanting constant restocking of totems means we're not as free to use our healing or damage abilities.

Sethanon
18-04-2006, 05:33 PM
pala aura's also dont stack with buffs so shaman totems shouldnt either =]

Ruargh
18-04-2006, 10:33 PM
well it should get fixed for pala's aswell imo its just plain odd you get a buff that doesnt buff when someone else is around ey? :)

after reading elex's post i feel very sorry for all shamans out there... ow wait that includes me aswell... :P
i know that every class still has loads of bugs or stuff 'thats working as intended' but still isnt, but its never nice to be confronted with that i guess ^^

although we are supposed to be a jack of all trades i get the feeling were outbalanced to pvp and duelling too much and loose terrain on other classes when it concerns pve...

Locowar
19-04-2006, 08:56 AM
I'm all for shamans getting buffed, just as long as they make WF a talent... it totally pwns SoC and SoC is a talent. WF A TALENT FIX PLX!

mugdruid
19-04-2006, 09:13 AM
although we are supposed to be a jack of all trades i get the feeling were outbalanced to pvp and duelling too much and loose terrain on other classes when it concerns pve...

Roll a druid and see what guilds ask from you when you want to raid.

Uzgash
19-04-2006, 09:30 AM
- Totems cost to much mana and don't last long enough. Now they also get destroyed by aoe.
- Half of our talents are a joke.
- Our end game sets are pure crap.
- As an elemental shaman you use a lot of mana but have no way of restoring mana.
- As an enhancement shaman your dps is based on luck.

Sethanon
19-04-2006, 09:33 AM
although we are supposed to be a jack of all trades i get the feeling were outbalanced to pvp and duelling too much and loose terrain on other classes when it concerns pve...

Roll a druid and see what guilds ask from you when you want to raid.

they will ask you to go feral ofcourse!

Elexin
19-04-2006, 09:47 AM
I just always thought it bizarre that some buffs didn't stack with others and ended up completely ignored :P Hadn't realised Auras were in the same boat.
Quite simply, they should both be fixed then :)

Uzumaki
19-04-2006, 11:29 AM
And ppl wonder why i dont play my Shaman anymore :-p
Maybe after that patch, who knows ...

Cassina
19-04-2006, 11:46 AM
Same, might have a little play around after the patch but Nthw is pretty much dead for now.

Chonar
19-04-2006, 12:41 PM
Shamans got nerfed then, eh?

Locowar
19-04-2006, 12:55 PM
FROST SHOK!!!!1

elog
19-04-2006, 01:31 PM
Just as a side note - some of them from the point of my lvl40 shaman (limited experience I know). Some of them while raiding BWL on Al'Akir as a Tauren Druid.

- No healer outside priests can reduce aggro in a good way- so Shamans are in the same boat as Druids, but worse off than Pallys since their heals create less aggro per point healed

- The stacking limitations are intended as far as I can tell - potions and buffs only stack to a limited degree to force people to get good gear.

- Totems need to be slightly redesigned for maximum raid utility - more talens around them to make them stronger, range increased etc

- All hybrid classes suffer in PvE - Hybrid results in jack of all trades=good in PvP, but well defined PvE roles which many find boring. I do not think there is much to do about this tbh. It is in the very definition of a hybrid (Pallys, Druids and Shamans come to mind). I actually even think that Shamans are probably the class that suffers the least of the three from this.

- Comparing Horde (Shaman) vs Alliance (Pally) raiding I must say that I was baffled by the amount of DPS the raid could achieve over a fight as Horde comparing to Alliance. And the raid I was in on Al'Akir was much less geared than CoI. So all in all, I find the Shaman vs Pally debate to be close to moot. Specific encounters are probably slightly harder/easier with pallys/shamans but that is it.

Locowar
19-04-2006, 02:32 PM
Just as a side note - some of them from the point of my lvl40 shaman (limited experience I know). Some of them while raiding BWL on Al'Akir as a Tauren Druid.
ZOMG gief spot to my rogue!:P

Ruargh
19-04-2006, 08:56 PM
the thing is that not many encounters are based on DPS.
ofcourse in the end its the dmg dealt that will kill the big ass dragon or bug or w/e. but it isnt the most important bit (does agro ring a bell? :)) me thinks. agro > dps importance wise imo ^^

and all and all i wasnt unhappy with my shaman in raids and i like the support role. the thing was that sometimes i had the feeling i could be much more supporting then i was able to with the current shaman :)

but i have to admit that my shaman is on ice for now aswell and might disapear completely once i get my lock to 60 :P
like others said maybe ill get the hang of it again after the review :)

P.S. still cant get on the damned server :cry:

Legendfierce
19-04-2006, 09:54 PM
Tbh i enjoy my shaman im happy with him as it is but wont say no to a review geting some nice talents etc..

Proterra
19-04-2006, 11:03 PM
i vote mugdruid for president of druids

cat froms dont haf no inevrtare kk?

Cassina
19-04-2006, 11:47 PM
Funny thing I found was that with the right gear & talents you can do some shocking DPS in MC raids, and with a "mage" trinket like ToEP you'd be even more powerful.
3k CL crits go go!

The tier 1 set was crap for this though, the PvP set was much better for elemental damage because nearly every item has +dmg/heal rather than just +heal.

Ogg
20-04-2006, 12:26 PM
Shamans can't effectively dps with elemental build at all, since they go oom extremely fast. The enhancement tree can only be used for endgame dps with überpwnpowah gear, and it still just turns the shaman into an aggro-magnet. Windfury is nice, but only works for those in the group, meaning that you can only give it to 3 rogues at a time, and at the same time, mages need tranquil air totems, and the maintank needs windfury too keep up his aggro too. There aren't always enough shamans for all these tasks.

Ogrosh
25-04-2006, 12:26 PM
Its true that Elemental Shamans can put out alot of DPS but as I have found they absolutely fly through the mana. If I decide to go all out and do as much dps as possible I can go OOM attacking something as simple as molten giants in MC before they go down and that doesn't take long. I don't have the largest amount of mana but 6400 raid buffed isn't too bad with some ok regen.

Spamming lightning bolt and with the occaisonal Earth Shock eats through mana so fast its untrue :(

Obviously I don't always do this, but have played about a bit to see what will happen.

My biggest issue is with the totems being a joke for all of the previously stated reasons and then Earthfury and Ten Storms being junk really.

I really think they should switch the +healing on EF to be healing and damage. Practically any shaman raiding now even if they have full Ten Storms would wear 5 pieces of EF for the set bonus, doesn't seem like much of an upgrade at all.

Cassina
25-04-2006, 12:55 PM
Spamming lightning bolt and with the occaisonal Earth Shock eats through mana so fast its untrue :(

Erm, rule number 1: never use earthshock when raiding because it causes too much threat - frostshock has higher damage anyway. :)
In the core I used to use CL/LB on most mobs and alternate between the two when waiting for the cooldown.

Thrane
25-04-2006, 01:38 PM
The tier 1 set was crap for this though, the PvP set was much better for elemental damage because nearly every item has +dmg/heal rather than just +heal.

Tier sets are designed for raiding though. There's no way they'll ever change that. And that's just what bliz designed the shammy's raiding setup for... support.

Same with warriors... Tier sets = tanking. I'm sure when Tier 3 is released it'll be the same.
Not much to do about that I'm afraid.

Elexin
25-04-2006, 03:05 PM
Thats just the thing though... have you ever looked at 10storms? Its not even that great for raiding :P

((However I'm convinced that earthshocking mobs shouldn't give you enough agro to pull a mob worth tanking off a tank... ))

Ogrosh
25-04-2006, 03:13 PM
Spamming lightning bolt and with the occaisonal Earth Shock eats through mana so fast its untrue :(

Erm, rule number 1: never use earthshock when raiding because it causes too much threat - frostshock has higher damage anyway. :)
In the core I used to use CL/LB on most mobs and alternate between the two when waiting for the cooldown.

When Joenino says "Try and pull aggro off me if you can" I am gonna try and do it for fun :razz:

As I said, I don't do this all the time, I experiment a bit here and there. I mostly use frost shock anyway as they seem to resist ES more :?

Frost Shock doesn't do more damage, especially not when you are wearing your http://www.thotbott.com/?i=37644


http://www.thotbott.com/?sp=10414

http://www.thotbott.com/?sp=10473

For the most part Chain lightning is pretty inefficient as it costs twice the amount of LB for not twice the damage. I use it whenever I get a clear cast or there is actually more than one mob it can jump to.

Ogrosh
25-04-2006, 03:16 PM
Thats just the thing though... have you ever looked at 10storms? Its not even that great for raiding :P

((However I'm convinced that earthshocking mobs shouldn't give you enough agro to pull a mob worth tanking off a tank... ))

Very true, no Shaman will wear full ten storms when raiding, it just plain sucks.

I rather foolishly assumed you would aim to get full tier 1 to raid in then full tier 2 would be a significant upgrade, in this case that clearly isn't true.

Ruargh
25-04-2006, 03:24 PM
i just love the bonus on chain heal we get with -every- fucking set there is... :(

Ogrosh
26-04-2006, 03:34 PM
Yeah, I hardly ever use that damn spell :?

Cassina
26-04-2006, 03:40 PM
I used it once and once only - bat woman in ZG for the rogues.

Ogrosh
26-04-2006, 03:46 PM
I used it once and once only - bat woman in ZG for the rogues.

Funnily enough after going to ZG for the first time on Monday I have thought that it may have some use there.

I really quite liked that place!

Uzgash
26-04-2006, 04:22 PM
This is what the ten storms should look like imo:
http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/itemset.html?setid=217

Azelton
26-04-2006, 04:32 PM
If you check the pics of 1st c'thun kill you will see several shamans wearing EF parts ^^

Ruargh
26-04-2006, 10:49 PM
yeas cuz ef actually has some usefull setbonuses (totems range anyone? :))

Sethanon
27-04-2006, 03:02 AM
This is what the ten storms should look like imo:
http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/itemset.html?setid=217

aww poor shamans =] i guess doing about 5-6kdmg in a few seconds aint enough =]
(includes the free AP trinket from bwl)

palas actually need that +dmg to do any at all.
i tried casting bos on horde so they instantly died but that only seems to work in pve : /

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 08:39 AM
This is what the ten storms should look like imo:
http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/itemset.html?setid=217

aww poor shamans =] i guess doing about 5-6kdmg in a few seconds aint enough =]
(includes the free AP trinket from bwl)

palas actually need that +dmg to do any at all.
i tried casting bos on horde so they instantly died but that only seems to work in pve : /

We can put out fairly good damage yeah, but you get to last forever, thats your trade off. You have to remember though in order to be able to do damage that good you would certainly not be wearing much set armour, its gonna be lots of random bits. What we are saying is that our tier 2 armour is not an upgrade PvE wise, where we heal and act as support.

So you don't think Tier 2 armour should be an overall upgrade from wearing tier 1? For people to still be wearing a good few parts of tier 1 armour when killing C'Thun is a tad silly don't you think?

Cassina
27-04-2006, 09:11 AM
C'Thun & AQ is not supposed to be the 3rd stage though where people should be using Tier 2, the new undead one is and AQ was just something to keep people busy.

It's not MC > BWL > AQ more like MC > BWL > Naxx

That said, I think most people will use tier 1 in that as well.

Elexin
27-04-2006, 09:32 AM
They will. The totem range bonus is a staple of the set, and with totems as they are, the range bonus is pretty much necessary.
The only problem is that as Blizzard make instances and fight areas bigger, the less useful totems become because of the range restrictions... and they're getting bigger all the time.

And I can't do 5-6k damage in a few seconds :(

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 09:51 AM
C'Thun & AQ is not supposed to be the 3rd stage though where people should be using Tier 2, the new undead one is and AQ was just something to keep people busy.

It's not MC > BWL > AQ more like MC > BWL > Naxx

That said, I think most people will use tier 1 in that as well.

Makes no difference what step it is supposed to be, people will still wear more EF than Ten Storms when raiding.

Ten Storms sucks as a set, a few bits are good individually but as a set it is extremely poor for what you would expect it to be used for.

As Elexin says, the fights are always getting bigger and as long as totems have limited range, EF bits have to be worn.

I can't do 5-6k damage in a few seconds either, thats a dream for a long way off yet :?

Cassina
27-04-2006, 09:54 AM
Yes you can, CL + EM = 5-6k to 3 targets in one hit.

Elexin
27-04-2006, 10:01 AM
Can I borrow your EM, and gain the ability to not die while casting please ? :)

Legendfierce
27-04-2006, 10:39 AM
gief 5k-6k dmg.

Butseriosuly our dmg is teh imba

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 10:57 AM
Yes you can, CL + EM = 5-6k to 3 targets in one hit.

Well I can't as I don't have EM :P

I dunno about you but my CL crits for about 1300 or so, but then I only have +148 spell damage +40 nature damage.

1300 x 3= 4200 and thats not even including the fact that it loses 30% damage each jump, so not quite 5-6k damage even if I did have EM, and then thats once every 5 minutes, thats not exactly amazing, especially spread over 3 targets.

Obviously it is possible if you are tricked out in all the best gear like in that EyeonEye video, but sadly I can't make that claim and most Shaman's on our server can't either.

Cassina
27-04-2006, 11:00 AM
I've had a crit for 2100 on the first target before (AV buff though), and regularly critted for 1600-1800 in AB. It is possible with the right build.

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 11:17 AM
I've had a crit for 2100 on the first target before (AV buff though), and regularly critted for 1600-1800 in AB. It is possible with the right build.

Out of curiousity, how much +spell/nature damage does Nthw have?

Cassina
27-04-2006, 11:29 AM
Only 144, but the talent build matters the most - like the imp CL/EF/EM.
http://wow.allakhazam.com/profile.html?538644

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 11:47 AM
Hmm, well the only thing you have that I don't in terms of adding any more damage to CL is the extra 10% damage from Improved Chain Lightning

I have a tiny bit more spell damage and then another +40 nature damage. I don't quite see how that 10% from the talent accounts for an extra 300-500 more damage on a CL crit than what I get :?

Seems I am getting gipped somewhere or my memory is shot and I'm actually hitting harder on CL crits than I think :oops:

Legendfierce
27-04-2006, 01:26 PM
Crit chance on a shaman over dmg anyway...

High dmg is nice indeed but i have about 12% chance to crit atm and will be pushed to 17% soonish without any gear with imp CL you can crit 1100+, Found this out with naked runs in Iron forge ;)

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 02:30 PM
Crit chance on a shaman over dmg anyway...

How come you will have 5% more soon? Don't you have tidal mastery atm?

How can you tell what your actual chance to crit with spells is? Its easy with melee but have never figured out how to check it with spells :?

Cassina
27-04-2006, 02:38 PM
I forget what the exact number is but it's the same as a mage chance to crit - every X of intellect = 1% spell crit + base crit (5% I think).

So if every 50 int gives 1% crit then a shaman with 300 int will have 11%, then you can add 5%/10% on to certain spells from talents and more also from gear (AB belt etc).

Something like that anyway, haven't played my shaman seriously for a long time.

Faylin
27-04-2006, 03:01 PM
http://www.wowwiki.com/Formulas:Critical_hit_chance

So according to Wowwiki it's 1% per 39,5 INT for Shizem.

Legendfierce
27-04-2006, 03:35 PM
Set bonus from ten storms with 1% on shoulders.

Not sure what the int/ Crit is but soon 16/17% will be close

You can check ur crit chance on Alakazam profiles or otehr onlin profiles. Will update mine and post on here soon.

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 03:40 PM
Nthw's allakhazam profile shows how much +spell crit he has but not the total. Not sure where it would tell you your actual spell crit chance.

Cassina
27-04-2006, 03:44 PM
You could add it up from the 39.5% formula + 1% crit on items + talents.

Ogrosh
27-04-2006, 04:02 PM
You could do yeah, but I am a lazy man and Legend said that it shows it so...

I will probably add it up for Og when I am home from work.

Celinde
27-04-2006, 10:21 PM
Oh hawt.. a Shaman thread..

Anyways, I'm leveling a shaman myself on a pvp server and got a few questions..

We could start (and end? -_-) with the talent issue.

My eyes was first drawn towards the elemental tree, because of the sweet controllable burst damage you get, and I thought it seemed like great.
Then I tested it out on the test server, and it drained my mana quite fast, and I'm not sure it will be a good choice to deplete your mana in a few seconds while grinding, even if the mob dies quick, it would also not be that funny to be caught oom.

Then I started to think about enhancement, and my question about that is just if 1-handers or 2-handers is the way to go while leveling?

And concerning restoration, it looks like something that would get more attractive at higher levels, but not while leveling..

Anyways, this is just some thoughts I got from playing Shaman for a short while, I hope someone could shed some light on this.

Cassina
28-04-2006, 12:03 AM
A sensible build would be 0/30/21 while levelling, put the points in enhancement first then into resto down to NS - when you get enough points for 2H then it's Windfury heaven :)
Elemental/resto is a waste of time unless someone else has aggro, which is why it's the ultimate level 60 raid build.

Celinde
28-04-2006, 01:04 AM
Ah, thanks for giving me some help with this =]

I then came up with something looking like This (http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/shaman/talents.html?0000000000000005005230115001023200050 05005050100)

Does it look somewhat okey or is it totally fucked up? =]

I'm sure it has some minor glitches, but figuring out the details is something I guess I'll learn during the way

Arkisha
28-04-2006, 06:21 AM
Ah, thanks for giving me some help with this =]

I then came up with something looking like This (http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/shaman/talents.html?0000000000000005005230115001023200050 05005050100)

Does it look somewhat okey or is it totally fucked up? =]

I'm sure it has some minor glitches, but figuring out the details is something I guess I'll learn during the way

Lose the points in improved grounding totem (It gets destroyed as soon as anything hits it so it doesn't really matter how often it absorbes spells), maybe put them into improved healing wave or something. That casting time reduction can make a hell of a difference.

Other than that it looks fine IMO :)

Ogrosh
28-04-2006, 08:37 AM
I'd definately lose the 2 points in grounding totem, as Arkisha says it disappears after 1 hit anyway.

Those 2 spare points would either go in toughness making it 5/5 or defense making it 3/5 but I'd put them in toughness myself. I wouldn't put them in Improved Healing wave as you won't ever use this except when do NS+Healing Wave for that uber instant heal.

Resto tree is spot on and exactly how the majority of people will build their resto tree upto 21.

Cassina
28-04-2006, 09:15 AM
I'd be tempted to try this:
http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/shaman/talents.html?0500000000000005005230105001020000050 50015050100
Never used combat endurance before so it could be interesting (think warlock demon armour), the last 5 you put in elemental in this build would be from levels 56-60.

Ogrosh
28-04-2006, 09:31 AM
I'd be tempted to try this:
http://www.wow-europe.com/en/info/basics/talents/shaman/talents.html?0500000000000005005230105001020000050 50015050100
Never used combat endurance before so it could be interesting (think warlock demon armour), the last 5 you put in elemental in this build would be from levels 56-60.

I have read some bad things about combat endurance, explaining how it is an absolute waste of time because it the amount it actually regens is tiny, I should imagine its gonna be one of the talents binned or reworked in 1.11

If you think how long it takes to regen health from a low amount back to full if you just stand there without eating, it takes ages, now multiply that by 10. Guess that kind of shows how bad it is.

Ashborn
28-04-2006, 10:30 AM
Lose the points in improved grounding totem (It gets destroyed as soon as anything hits it so it doesn't really matter how often it absorbes spells)
Lies. Any warlock will tell you that it only disappears when a pure DD spell hits it. Any dots/death coils/etc just disappear into it's gaping maw. That said, I'd say it's mainly a pvp talent with somewhat limited usefulness, still would be bloody annoying at times.

Ogrosh
28-04-2006, 02:38 PM
If that talent reduced the cooldown on it then it would be worth it :P